Any Sources For The Mace Or Hammer In One Hand?

[Richard Marsden]

Annnnddd washout. So much for me discovering unlooked at or ill-considered mace/axe/hammer techniques.

I tracked down the original book and the art is 19th century. Artist was Fredreich von Martin Reibisch, and the paintings were created in the 1840's. No idea if they are 'made up' or inspired, or what-not. I have taken this as far as I can.

On an upnote... this image would make for a good demotivational poster. Two knights on the ground from a joust.

[nathan f]

Well i know for a fact the maces they are using were a pretty common sight they were used for tournaments as opposed to actual weapons just a hardwood club to knock an opponent off his horse. often tied onto a persons hand.
May i be so bold as to suggest an irish source for this though its not a mace the traditional irish fighting stick is pretty close to one its a cudgel a wooden stick with a weighted end in various sizes sometime weighter with lead. known to most as the shileghlagh well anyways these weapons have some nice systems to them simple but effective how a style should be.
Also if max is around he could add the images of these in an earlier context the mace oddo used is a similar design.
here is the older style having tried it and seen a source of it used with a shield it works well with it. you can see how the off hand is used to cover the chest.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=868X1FMQRu8

the other style is more modern 1600-1700 im sorry i forget the exact dating. it arose from the faction fighting in ireland.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcH0ww_Jbfg

[steve hick]

I know we've got manuals that cover the pole hammer, Talhoffer shows the mace in strange context and there's pictorial evidence that Meyer was familiar with some kind of wooden club but has any well rounded teaching on the single handed mace or hammer surfaced yet?

There is an almost vanishly small section in Quixada's work, otherwise on horsemanship and the lance, about horseback and the targets for the hammer. Quixada is translated in Noel Fallows new work on jousting.
Steve

[Myles Cupp]

On an upnote... this image would make for a good demotivational poster. Two knights on the ground from a joust.

Duly noted, though the knight on the right horse isn't quite on the ground yet... still an epic fail for both of them.

As for those pictures in particular with the two guys fighting on foot with the dueling shields, somehow they seem very familiar to me as something I've seen before in Mair's stuff when we were in that other thread on Mair. I'll take a peek when I can.

[Piermarco T]

Alexandro Massario Malatesta (published 1600).

This is on google books

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=mH88 ... &q&f=false

Just half a page of general considerations on the axe, mace and hammer from horseback (at the bottom of page 10). He says these weapons are not much used "these days" and that they are used more in duels than in combats and "encounters" since they are awkward to wound with and recover.

[Richard Marsden]

Very neat find! How did you come across it?

[Piermarco T]

Thanks, nothing fancy though, just searched in google books for Alessandro Malatesta (although incidentally the upper limit on publication date in the advanced search function can often be a useful help).

For all that sounds like Malatesta is not so keen on the mace, although I wouldn't have expected maces to be that widely used by 1600.

[Jon Pellett]

I think it says roughly:

"The axe, mace, and hammer, though not much used at present, are nevertheless still employed; the mace should be heavy at the point, comfortable in the grip, and not very long; it can be round, square, three-parted, with points and with facets. In fighting with these weapons don’t clench your fist too tightly, because that would torment your arm, and would weaken your attack; but lower it with violent force, and present it to the enemy; and likewise with the axes, of which the Polish kind are best, because they are counterbalanced with a square spike on one side, with which they offend greatly, and in the same way the hammer has almost the same offence, except that the side spike is longer. These axes and hammers are sooner used in duels than in battles and encounters, because they are difficult to strike with and to recover again."

Cool.

[John Harmston]

present it to the enemy

I take it this means to hold it in a guard that affords some defensive benefits. Thoughts?

[Ben Floyd]

I was initially thinking the same thing, but I seem to remember that swords were 'presented' to the opponent when riding past. Can't remember where I heard it.