Barbarians and Boats, Book reviews

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Barbarians and Boats, Book reviews

Postby Richard Marsden » Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:24 pm

Latest books I've read of some WMA use

Barbarians, Maruauders and Infidels by Antonio Santosusso
http://www.amazon.com/Barbarians-Marauders-Infidels-Medieval-Warfare/dp/0813391539/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1320020011&sr=8-1

The book covers medieval warfare from the fall of Rome to the advent of gunpowder and the Renaissance. TSantosuisso covers a little bit of everything from the hilariously destructive Longobards, who are so used to looting, pillaging, and destroying things, that when they settled in Italy they kept looting and pillaging and destroying themselves, to Muslim invaders, to specific commentary on weapons as well as tactics in the realm of heavy cavalry and infantry with specific details on formation and use in the field. Of note for the WMA crowd will be the section on battle tactics, weaponry and armor which the author spends some time on.

Interestingly enough, the author also shows different points of view, citing modern historians and their take on certain events, even if they conflict.

Sovereign of the Seas by Angus Konstam
http://www.amazon.com/Sovereigns-Sea-Perfect-Renaissance-Battleship/dp/0470116676/ref=sr_1_sc_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1320020242&sr=1-1-spell

This fascinating read covers the construction of warships from the Hundred Years war to the 1600's, with the Sovereign of the Seas representing the first 'ship of the line' that could have sailed alongside HMS Victory 200 years later and done just fine.

The story involves the reluctant use of math in constructing ships, the often wasteful expenditure on boats, that rarely saw action, and the slow, uneasy and uneven transition from boarding actions to gunnery. Of special note are the wrecks which have been recovered, how they were, an what was on board- in particular Henry VIII's Mary Rose and Gustaf Adolphus' Vassa. Of note to the WMA crowd, weaponry on the Mary Rose and the unsure and haphazard way warfare changed and was (or was not) written about. Just as we lack written 'how to' material, the same goes for those interested in the naval side of Medieval to Renaissance and Baroque history. The author has snippets of information, and has to piece together what the ships looked like, how they fought, how and why they sank and how the mish-mosh of technology was used. Nice to know that those in other fields encounter the same issues as WMA researchers.
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Re: Barbarians and Boats, Book reviews

Postby Jean Chandler » Tue Nov 15, 2011 12:07 pm

Speaking of ships and WMA, did you know there was a 15th Century warship called the Peter Von Danzig?

Image

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_von_Danzig_(ship)

This large carrack was left abandoned by a French merchant in Gdansk and then refitted as a warship when war with England broke out. The Prussians fitted it out as a privateer and it fought in several successful actions.

The wiki on the ship doesn't mention it but the Peter Von Danzig was involved in an action in which they claimed this famous and amazing Hans Memling Triptych as a prize, causing a diplomatic incident with the Duke of Burgundy and the Medici's...

Image

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Last_Judgment_(Memling)

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Re: Barbarians and Boats, Book reviews

Postby Jake Norwood » Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:14 pm

Holy crap, I saw that Triptych in person in Poland in 1999. It's *awesome*.
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Re: Barbarians and Boats, Book reviews

Postby Jean Chandler » Tue Nov 15, 2011 2:10 pm

I really want to see it, in Oliwa Cathedral right? Is it huge? I so badly want to go to Gdansk!

That is the Medici agent to Bruges, Thomasso Portinari, being judged with his hands piously in prayer on St. Michael's right-hand scale. Portinari financed the work with Medici money he wasn't supposed to spend.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tommaso_Portinari

All the other people in the painting are friends or enemies of the artist, Memling, who knew everyones physical characteristics from the baths, and subtly satirized them in some cases. Enemies are in the fire mostly (plus a few friends)

The guy in command of the ship during the raid was a Danzig town Councilor. They really don't make politicans like they used to.


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Re: Barbarians and Boats, Book reviews

Postby Jake Norwood » Tue Nov 15, 2011 2:46 pm

It was on tour; I think I saw it in Warsaw or Krakow. Sadly, I've never been to Gdansk.

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Re: Barbarians and Boats, Book reviews

Postby Richard Marsden » Tue Nov 15, 2011 4:33 pm

On your left, "Heaven" and on your right, the cover to a Heavy Metal Album circa 1983.

Nice image and story. I've seen it before (never in person) but now I can say that's not only awesome, it's pirated.

In 'Sovereign of the Seas" there is an entire chapter on the Baltic in the 1550-1600's and how that led to improvements in ship designs. The most amusing story is that of the Vasa. She sinks on her maiden voyage under similar circumstances to the Mary Rose. Like the Mary Rose she was plucked from the waters many years later and now lies perfectly preserved in a museum.

Behold her glory.
http://www.traveladventures.org/continents/europe/vasa-museum06.shtml

The Mary Rose is still (maybe always will be) being sprayed down, but that one is neat because half of her rotted away, giving viewers a cross-section of the ship. You can find her, as well as the Victory, Warrior and other neat ships in Portsmouth. Well worth a visit if you end up in England.
http://www.archnews.co.uk/world-archaeology/uk-archaeology/4305-new-insights-into-items-from-the-mary-rose.html

Side Naval Story

If you get a chance read Heart of the Sea, the story of the Essex, a whaling ship that is sunk by a whale. Irony. It is a true story, and starts off at the end of the tale with two, withered men in a whaleboat, each gnawing on human bones and clutching to them feverishly as they are rescued. With a start like that, surely it must be a good read. Quakers, whalers, and cannibalism awaits.

http://www.amazon.com/Heart-Sea-Tragedy-Whaleship-Essex/dp/0141001828/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1321403789&sr=8-1
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Re: Barbarians and Boats, Book reviews

Postby Jean Chandler » Tue Nov 15, 2011 7:11 pm

I knew all about the Mary Rose due to way too many hours spent on research and pointless forum debates about things like longbows ... and I'd heard of the Vasa but I had no idea it was so well preserved!

Image

In 'Sovereign of the Seas" there is an entire chapter on the Baltic in the 1550-1600's and how that led to improvements in ship designs.


Dammit man now you have caused me to put yet another book on my Amazon queue which is already twice as big as it has any right to be...

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Re: Barbarians and Boats, Book reviews

Postby Jean Chandler » Tue Nov 15, 2011 7:23 pm

Memling is a fantastic artist, check out this one 'scenes from the passion of Christ', also financed by Portinari

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... ssione.jpg

And another similar one

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... ng_056.jpg

These have great little details with insights into life at the time of the 15th Century fencing Masters like Talhoffer and Von Danzig. The armor (I love the blued -tempered look to the steel) and clothing and so on, the houses and the things people are doing. I wish I had super high res images of these so I could make like 5 foot wide posters to put on my walls. Wife would probably argue about it though :evil:

Portinari also sponsored the equally talented Hugo Van Der Goes, who created this one named after him
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... es_004.jpg

Portinari got his whole family in that one (both of his sons and his wife and her daughter)

A vain and foolish man. He was smart though it gave him a kind of immortality.

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Re: Barbarians and Boats, Book reviews

Postby Richard Marsden » Tue Nov 15, 2011 7:45 pm

Lovely art. In my class on humanities I teach about art movements (all of them in 1 week) and try to give the kids a nice sampling. Will be adding this.

I also have a certain love of hellscapes.

Enjoy "Sovereign of the Seas" when it comes up on your list!
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Re: Barbarians and Boats, Book reviews

Postby Jean Chandler » Tue Nov 15, 2011 8:22 pm

I'm with you on the hellscapes, and I'm sure so were the people back in the day. In fact they liked to take it a step further and make 3 dimensional hellscapes with animated "automata' robots to leer and clack their teeth at them. Like this one from the 15th Century on display at the Castello Sforsa in Italy

Image

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-YM2k8AZmPT4/T ... -1._01.JPG

http://morbidanatomy.blogspot.com/2011/ ... 6th-c.html

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