@ Michael E. - I totally jive with your approach to Krump here. I used to use it extensively in early 2005 and 2006 (following a pretty public debate over it all in Provo with John C.). However, I admit that I never spent much time trying it in sparring or from schrankhut (which I tend to neglect in sparring). I'll have to revisit that.
@ All - Great stuff here. Regarding the Krump as it breaks ochs, I've found that the Messer version works fantastically well in the longsword, particularly if I'm willing to seek a bind. So much that it's my "standard" use right now (I pulled it out a few times in Houston lat month, actually). I feel that it really effectively nullifies Ochs under the definition of breaking that I discussed at the front of the thread. The "Goliath" version, which Michael is advocating, feels like it might be the best/most reliable variation for actually hitting the hands of a guy in left ochs, though, if you're not seeking the bind. And the mechanics of thrusting the left arm under the right, etc., still apply in the event of a bind, of course.
Christian H. Tobler wrote:There's an interesting tactical difference between breaking Ochs using vom Tag as the starting point vs. using Schranckhut. The stroke from vom Tag is faster, but you have to work harder to get outside his Ochs. Conversely, the stroke from Schranckhut is slower (longer arc), but you're already outside his guard.
I suppose you do have to work harder, since you're not as far outside of it as you are in schrank, but is it that much of a difference in gaining the outside? Much of this can probably be negated by the arc that Michael's describing, or even just beginning the Krump with a more zorn-like motion. How does this change in time requirement modify the tactical use of the krump, if at all?
RE: Image 4 - I have always thought this was roughly the same Duplieren from the left as shown in Image 3, except illustrated from the opposite side. Goliath's illustrations seem to do that frequently--show the same technique twice, performed on the same side, but illustrated from two viewpoints (one on each side).